"I'm just going to come right out and say it, who put the car on the Avery property?"
Analysis of the documentary 'Making of a Murderer'
By PavlishConsulting.com
December 29, 2015
PCG (Pavlish Consulting Group) unedited rough draft. 60% complete.
I. What happens when the wrong people get power.
II. It is hard for the public to help in most cases.
III. Will a coward come forward? The very ugly, the ugly and the unknown.
IV. Analyzing some of the statements, interviews and testimony.
V. A small sample of the bungled case.
VI. PCG Inc and the PCG process.
VII. Closing.
I. What Happens when the wrong people get power.
For many years I have analyzed different murder cases, and the majority of the cases I’ve agreed with the verdict, and the accused were punished. People may feel the punishment was too harsh or too lenient, but they were punished and it was another example of our great legal system.
Then there were cases where a guilty person is either freed or found innocent by a jury of their peers, such as former FBI agent Art Gonzales, whom I listed as a case study on our website, PavlishConsulting.com. This is sad and hurtful not only for the family of the victim, but it hurts me personally. Unfortunately, in these cases I understand we still have a great legal system, and when twelve people see things differently, then there is nothing I, the government or the public can do.
However, nothing is more nauseating and upsetting then knowing an innocent person is in jail, especially when it’s at the will of individuals of authority.
When a person is accused of a crime they are at the mercy of people that wield tremendous power and control. Their fate is in the hands of Police Officers, Judges, District Attorney’s, Assistant Prosecutors, Special State and Federal Police, Court Staff, Corrections Officers, and many more. Some people in these positions thrive on power and control. Most of these elected, appointed or hired employees realize they have have been bestowed tremendous power, and if used improperly can cause tremendous harm. They have the power to change the course of peoples lives as entrusted enforcers of State and/or Federal laws.
It is not plausible or believable to think that every single person of power working for any village, town, city, state or federal organization is able to handle this enormous power they are given responsibly.
It is not plausible or realistic for any American to believe that some individuals wouldn't be smart enough to reference or use their position of trust as a tool to hide their wrong doing or the wrongs of others.
It is not plausible or realistic to believe that once they are given their title and power that the citizens of the United States should be embarrassed or shamed if "We the People" question their actions. In fact, it is We the People that should be insulted when we are scoffed at and belittled when we see obvious mistakes and cover-ups.
When some citizens are given a title, a badge, a uniform, a state ID card, state issued weapon and power, their descent into the dark side begins the minute they take an oath to protect the citizens of this great Country.
Power and control can be a very destructive drug. More powerful then any street drug such as cocaine and heroin in every sense. When someone is having a power trip, it is the same experience someone would have on an acid trip. Once they are on the drug of power, it distorts their reasoning, judgment and the ability to distinguish between right and wrong.
Reality, reasoning, common sense, caring, compassion, good judgement, morals, and values are replaced with delusions, feeling of euphoria, feelings of being invisible, recklessness, carelessness, uncaring, the ability to reason, and the ability to distinguish or care about what is right and what is wrong.
This power trip gives them the callous and cold ability to take human beings and essentially use them as a lab rats at their discretion. These power-hungry selfish, cowards seek out and find other week, selfish, cowards that have authority to befriend.
This is without a doubt the case with Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey, who are sitting in jail right now because of numerous people who had the power and control to use them for their own agenda. They could care less how many people they hurt, or how badly.
II. ITS HARD FOR GOOD PEOPLE TO HELP SOMETIMES.
In the majority of cases good people can scream from the highest mountain and their screams will fall on deaf ears. All that is needed is either one or two of the numerous shameful lying cowards involved to come forward and bring down the house of cards. Or someone who is not involved but can provide valuable clues instead of hiding and hoping everything will go away. Once they do this they will find peace, happiness, respect and forgiveness.
As I will explain in the last section there is .5% (or less) chance that the true cowards will come forward. They will take their lies to their grave, and convince themselves they did nothing wrong. There are also others involved in this case that have a conscious and may be willing to break free from the heavy burden they are carrying.
I am going to list just some of the good, the very ugly, the ugly. These are people you need to put pressure on to do the right thing.
To everyone involved directly or indirectly:
It is never too late to say you are sorry and do the right thing. Things do happen for a reason and Karma is a you know what.
III. Will a coward come forward? The very ugly, the ugly and the unknown.
____________________________________________________
POSSIBLE GOOD
Someone that can choose to help:
Robert C. Hermann
Current Sheriff of Manitowoc County
In an interview with the Manitowoc Herald Times Reporter, Sheriff Robert Hermann criticized the objectivity of the series, calling it "skewed chicken". Hermann conceded that he had not watched the series.
Saying this was a mistake by Sheriff Hermann. We all make mistakes and simply saying, I’m sorry takes a lot of the pain away. I listed Sheriff Hermann as the most important person to fix the problem. He is the current Sheriff for a reason, and before I spoke with him I viewed the probability of Sheriff Hermann helping at 60%. After one phone call with Sheriff Hermann I now believe there is an 80% chance Sheriff Robert Hermann will do the right thing.
80% chance Mr. Hermann will do the right thing.
Dear Sheriff Robert C. Hermann:
As I told you via our nice phone conversation, it’s time to really look at the Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey case with an open mind, and critiquing the case negatively is not something you should be doing.
You are the one that has the power and ability to restore faith in the system, and bring justice to everyone that was denied what “We the People” deserve.
You can undo the destruction that some very bad people caused, and you hold the key to doing the right thing, and ending this fairly quickly. You can help Teresa’s family and countless people get the justice they deserve.
Things happen for a reason Robert. There is a reason you are the Sheriff now, and there is a reason we had a very good phone conversation. You hold all the cards, and you can stand up for what is right for everyone involved in the great state of Wisconsin.
The legal system will make mistakes and it takes men and women to admit there were mistakes and fix them at any cost.
Holding a simple press conference and getting the ball rolling is the first step, and the right first move. I think I speak for many people that hope you have what it takes.
____________________________________________________
POSSIBLE GOOD
Scott Walker
CURRENT WISCONSIN GOVERNOR
Scott Kevin Walker is the 45th and current Governor of Wisconsin. First elected governor in the 2010 Wisconsin general election, he survived a 2012 recall election and was reelected governor in the 2014 Wisconsin gubernatorial election. Wikipedia
40% chance Mr. Walker will do the right thing.
___________________________________________________
POSSIBLE GOOD
Sheriff Jerry Pagel
Calumet County Sheriff’s Department.
Sheriff Pagel clearly made this statement during a televised press conference: “The Manitowoc County Sheriff Department’s role in this investigation was to provide resources for us when they were needed. As we needed items on the property to conduct searches they provided that piece of equipment, and that’s their role, and only role in this investigation.”
Unless the words resources, items and equipment are code for Sheriff Kenneth Peterson, Lieutenant James Lenk, and Sergeant Andrew L. Colburn, that statement is not even close to factual or accurate.
30% chance Mr. Pagel will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
POSSIBLE GOOD
The Wisconsin Innocence project.
I won't add the possibility since they should be on this immediately.
They can fully support all the people that were treated unfairly in the Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey prosecution.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Lieutenant James Lenk
Manitowoc Sheriff’s Department.
Lying shameful coward and one of the main conspirators.
0% chance James Lenk will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Sergeant Andrew L. Colburn
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department
Lying shameful coward and one of the main conspirators.
0% chance Andrew Colburn will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
Served from 1979-2007
Lying pitiful coward. Also delusional, deranged and the main conspirator.
0% chance this lying deranged coward will do the right thing.
___________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Scott Tadych
Brendan Dassey’s Step-Father
Lying pitiful coward.
Who cares if he does the right thing. He is useless and shouldn't have testified at the trial.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Chief Deputy Eugene Kusche
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
1979-2003
Lying pitiful coward
.1% chance Eugene Kusche will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Len Kachinsky
Court appointed attorney for Brendan Dassey.
Lying pitiful coward. If the worst coward on earth was rated a 0, Len Kachinsky is a minus 50.
0% chance of doing the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Michael O’Kelly
Len Kachinsky’s investigator.
He is in the same class as Mr. Kachinsky.
Lying pitiful coward.
If the worst coward on earth was rated a 0, Michael O’Kelly is a minus 50.
0% chance of doing anything right, let alone the right thing.
__________________________________________________
THE VERY UGLY
Under Sheriff Robert Hermann
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
Lying pitiful coward.
1% chance Mr. Hermann will do the right thing.
* More comments in section IV
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Detective Dave Remiker
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department
Deceitful.
1% chance Mr. Remiker will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Bobby Dassey
Steven Avery’s nephew and Brendan Dassey’s brother.
He lied and was confused.
75% chance he will or has done the right thing by now.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Co-lead Investigator Mark Weigart
Lying pitiful coward.
20% chance Mr. Weigart does the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Co-lead Investigator Tom Fassbender
Lying pitiful coward.
30% chance Mr. Fassbender will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Sandy Morris
Steven Avery’s Cousin
Lying pitiful coward.
15% chance Ms. Morris will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Judge Jerome Fox
Judge for Brendan Dassey
Ridiculous unfair rulings.
0% chance Mr. Fox will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Norm Gahn
Assistant Special Prosecutor
Lying pitiful coward.
1% chance Mr. Gahn will do the right thing.
Norm stated that Lieutenant Lenk and Sergeant Colburn “are good solid citizens, and good decent men.”
No Mr. Gahn they are the opposite of good men. It is insulting that the defense makes your blood boil when these citizens whom are not solid and decent are questioned about their unethical despicable behavior. Your comments should make everyone’s blood boil Sir.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Mark Rohrer
Manitowoc District Attorney
Lying pitiful coward.
.1% chance Mr. Rohrer will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Douglass K. Jones
Manitowoc Assistant District Attorney.
Lying pitiful coward.
.5% chance Mr. Jones will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Sheriff Tom Kocourek
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
1979-2001
Lying pitiful coward.
.1% chance Mr. Kocourek will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Sergeant Jason Orth
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
Deceitful.
Sergeant Orth was the first Deputy on the scene when Pamela Strum “found” the Toyota Rav 4. He stated “he arrived at approximately 10:59 am.” ( approximately 10:59?)
Sergeant Orth was watching the car when Lieutenant Lenk from the Manitowic County Sheriff’s Department arrived.
Lieutenant Lenk testified under oath in Mr. Avery’s trail that he arrived at 2:05 pm before Sergeant Orth was told to keep a log by an unknown law enforcement official.
Sergeant Orth testified that he started keeping a log of who came to look at the Toyota Rav 4 at 2:45 pm.
However, Lieutenant Link previously stated under oath on August 9th 2006 that he arrived between 6:30 and 7:00 pm, yet there was no record of him on the log that Sergeant Orth was keeping?
Lieutenant Lenk knew before the trial that they were going to bring up the log, so he had to change his story under oath and state he was there at 2:05pm “before” Sergeant Orth was instructed by some unknown person to start keeping a log of who came to the scene.
Forget all of Lieutenant’s Lenk’s memory problems regarding his presence at the poorly staged crime scene. Lieutenant Lenk and Sergeant Orth work for the Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department and they weren't suppose to be involved in the case. Once again wherever there is evidence, or evidence that miraculously happens to be found it is the Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department that “finds’ most of it?
Again Calumet County Sheriff Jerry Pagel said this,“The Manitowoc County Sheriff Department’s role in this investigation was to provide resources for us when they were needed. As we needed items on the property to conduct searches they provided that piece of equipment, and that’s their role, and only role in this investigation.
50% chance Mr. Orth will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Judge Willis
Presided over the Steven Avery Trial.
Unreasonable and unfair decisions.
First judge to allow EDTA analysis to be presented as evidence.
The FBI hasn't performed a test to determine if there is EDTA in blood for ten years prior to Judge Willis allowing the information to be presented in his court room.
.1% chance he will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Dennis Vogel
Manitowic County District Attorney
1977-1986
Currently: www.wheelerlaw.com/vogel.htm
Denis Vogel | Wheeler Law Offices ... Experience: Mr. Vogel regularly serves as lead counsel in defense of a ... for Municipal Judges; Served as District Attorney for Manitowoc County for 10 years.
Lying pitiful coward
.2% chance Mr. Vogel will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Deputy Judy Dvorak
Manitowic County Sheriff’s office.
1981-1987
Lying pitiful coward.
15% chance Ms. Dvorak will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLY
Sherry Culhane
DNA Technical unit leader.
Lying pitiful coward.
10% chance Ms. Culhane will do the right thing.
___________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Pamela Sturm
Teresa’s Cousin.
She had a direct line to the Sheriff?
She and Nicole were the only two volunteers given access to a forty acre junkyard?
She found the car in 20 minutes?
She was the only volunteer given a camera?
She went directly to the hill where the Toyota Rave 4 was “hidden”?
Something doesn't add up with Pamela Sturn and her daughter Nicole. What else were they told?
There is a 95% chance Pamela and Nicole know more, and a 70% chance they will admit it.
____________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Ryan Hillegas
Teresa’s ex-boyfriend
He was extremely deceitful on the witness stand.
I am 100% certain Ryan Hillegas knows more, and I am 100% certain he will reveal what he knows if interviewed properly.
____________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Scott Bloedorn
Teresa’s roommate.
Scott Bloedorn barely spoke, and needs to be properly interviewed.
99% chance he can provide needed information.
_________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Deputy Daniel Kucharski
Calumet County Sheriff’s Department
Deputy Kucharski was at Mr. Avery’s house with Lieutenant Lenk and Sergeant Colburn when Lieutenant Lenk miraculously “found” the key after four days.
Deceitful on the stand.
Stated he didn't think Lieutenant James Lenk or Sergeant Colburn could have planted the key because they would have to have the key. (See section IV Analyzing some of the statements, interviews and testimony).
40% chance Mr. Kucharski will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Dr. Mark LeBeau
Chemistry Unit Chief
Dr. Lebeau can explain the science behind the EDTA blood test that hasn't been used in ten years prior to Steven Avery’s trial. He can explain what the actual detection limit was for finding EDTA in the blood swabs. He can clearly explain the fact the test has only been admitted as evidence by Judge Willis, and he can start an investigation that would clear Mr. Avery and Mr. Dassey.
70% chance Dr. Lebeau will do the right thing.
____________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
24 jurors
They can come forward and let the public know they were misinformed, and their opinions were tainted by false information given by Special Prosecutor Kenneth Kratz to the media and the public before the trial.
100% chance that at least one juror will come forward.
____________________________________________________
THE UNKNOWN
Sergeant William Tyson
Calumet County Sheriff’s Department.
Supervised Lieutenant James Lenk, Sergeant Andrew Colburn and Detective Dave Remiker from the Manitowow County Sheriff’s office when they first searched Steven Avery’s trailer. Under his watch no key was found. However, on November 8th, when Lieutenant James Lenk and Sergeant Colburn searched the Steven Avery’s trailer yet again, then Lieutenant James Lenk amazingly happened to find the key.
____________________________________________________
THE UGLIEST
Kenneth Kratz
Former Calumet County Special Prosecutor.
Lying pitiful coward.
.0001% chance Mr. Kratz will do the right thing.
Special Prosecutor Kenneth Kratz resigned in 2010 after he tried to seduce a young woman who was the victim of Domestic Violence when he was prosecuting her boyfriend.
Ive spoken to numerous murderers and cowards via the telephone or via email. I have yet to come across one that hasn't been willing to talk, or respond.
I emailed Mr. Kratz on December 26th:
Subject line -
There is a 99.5% chance that you won't listen to anyone but yourself. However, I am offering you a gift that I don't offer people like you, and maybe you are the .5% that listens.
John Pavlish <pavlishcg@gmail.com>
Dec 26 (2 days ago)
to kratzlawfirm
Ken,
Just in case my other email didn't go through, your approach will never work. If you ever get to the point where you want to rebuild your life call me and I will take you as a client for free. Your first step is to stop trying to explain anything, it is hurting you and everyone involved even more, and you need to be silent right now. Within one month you will be back and more successful than ever, but not doing what you're doing now.
John
PCG Inc
PavlishConsulting.com
Facebook.com/PavlishConsulting
O:216-404-4612
C:216-258-8911
Ken Kratz
Dec 26 (2 days ago)
to me
I don't aspire to be successful anymore. Since my recovery from prescriptions, I just make good decisions today, and give up the consequences to some higher power. Thanks though for the offer.
John Pavlish <pavlishcg@gmail.com>
Dec 26 (2 days ago)
to Ken
Money doesn't mean success Ken. Getting over a drug habit doesn't mean success, nor does giving yourself to a higher power. You said you made a good decision today, however you unfortunately don't get it. Success is something that is earned, and something I hope your good decision today and in the future will reflect, but I am positive your mind isn't processing what good decisions are at this time.
That does not mean there isn't a good person in there, It means the higher power is waiting for you to be the good person. The higher power is putting the ball in your court Ken.
Did you find courage, strength, the ability to admit terrible mistakes, the ability to help others, and the ability to be strong today? I don't think you did, and you passed on a very good opportunity. Good luck to you, and don't look to the higher power. Do what is needed, and then you will be rewarded by the higher power.
Deputy Daniel Kucharski
Testimony from Steven Avery’s trial
SPECIAL PROSECUTOR KENNETH KRATZ: “Did you believe that either Lieutenant Lenk or Sergeant Colburn had an opportunity out of your eyesight to plant that key there”?
DEPUTY DANIEL KUCHARSKI: “No I did not.”
SPECIAL PROSECUTOR KENNETH KRATZ: How can you be so sure?
DEPUTY DANIEL KUCHARSKI: (Shrugs shoulders followed by a sigh and a five second pause), “ Well first of all they they would had to have the key um I, I think the only person that would've had the key was the person that that killed Teresa.”
JERRY BUTING: “Objection speculation”
JUDGE WILLIS: “Sustained.”
JERRY BUTING: “Move to strike.”
JUDGE WILLIS: “The court will order the answer stricken.”
Deputy Kucharski if you caught Lieutenant Lenk or Sergeant Colburn with the key in their pocket outside of the house then you would’ve had the killer right?
Deputy Kucharski do you think if you picked up they key you might be arrested?
How could Deputy Kucharski as an officer of the law say such a thing?
It was stricken from the record but the jury still heard Deputy Kucharski announce that it was his belief that if you had the key, you were the killer? This comment is beyond belief.
SPECIAL PROSECUTOR KENNETH KRATZ: I want you to limit your comments to your observations. What about your observations do you believe ah it was impossible or improbable to plant that key.”
DEPUTY DANIEL KUCHARSKI: “ My actual observation um I would have to say that that it it could be possible, um as in I was doing other things. I was taking photographs, I was um searching the nightstand.”
First of all hold the horses Deputy Kucharski. You started your testimony stating that you believed Lieutenant James Lenk and Sergeant Andrew L Colburn didn't have the opportunity to plant the key. Try to remember Deputy Kucharski because less than forty seconds later you stated, ’It could be possible.”
Secondly you first stated in your testimony that Lieutenant James Lenk and Sergeant Andrew Colburn didn't have the opportunity to plant the key outside of your eyesight. Again less than forty seconds later you are taking pictures? That is your testimony in less than forty seconds?
But wait theres more. You stated, “I was um searching the nightstand.” Deputy Kucharski what nightstand did you search? How can you take pictures and search a nightstand and think the two lying cowards Detective James Lenk and Sergeant Andrew L. Colburn didn't have the opportunity to drop the key?
Lieutenant James Lenk
Lieutenant James Lenk was as cold as ice during every interview, deposition, and testimony that I witnessed. He was so cold he appeared tranquilized. Lieutenant James Link is cold and calculating. He has no emotion, and he rarely showed signs of caring when he was telling obvious lies under oath. The tone of his voice elevated one time during the interviews and testimony I viewed.
Special Prosecutor Kenneth Kratz asked Lieutenant Lenk if he “planted the blood in the Toyota Rav 4”?
Lieutenant Lenk answered, “No sir definitely not.” Lieutenant Lenk very loudly said “definitely not.”
In many cases when people are being deceitful they loudly put emphasis on words or statements. They unknowingly do this to prove to you that you need to believe their lie.
This is similar to President Clinton saying, “I did not have sexual relations with that woman.” What President Clinton told me was, “I did have sexual relations with that women.”
What Lieutenant Lenk told me was this: I definitely am hiding a lot, and I definitely am lying.
Sergeant Andrew Colburn
Sergeant Colburn is just as cold as Lieutenant Lenk and it’s not surprising that Sheriff Kenneth Peterson dispatched these two to do the serious dirty work.
I want to clearly state that there is something seriously wrong with Sergeant Andrew Colburn, Lieutenant James Lenk and former Sheriff Kenneth Peterson. Almost every word that comes out of their mouths is a lie and it would take me weeks to break down all their lies. They are extremely cold and they lie as if they were asked what is two plus two. It is effortless for them, and they are three of coldest people I’ve ever seen.
I did want to pick two of Sergeants Colburns statements from his testimony at Steven Avery’s trial, and I think I will be able to move to the next person.
SERGEANT COLBURN:“I have to say this is the first time by integrity has ever been questioned.”
DEAN STRANG: “This is the first time your integrity has been questioned”?
SERGEANT COLBURN: “As it applies to being a police officer, yes.”
PCG - JOHN PAVLISH: Let me clear something up for you Andy, you are not a police officer, nor are you a man. You are a coward. The problem is when I call you a coward it is insulting all the cowards in the world. You are five levels below a coward. I know it and you know it. Do the department a favor and resign.
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson and his Department were very involved, and they all loved to talk and give their opinions to anyone that would listen.
Here is just one of the interviews given by Sheriff Kenneth Peterson to a local TV station where he made these statements:
1) SHERIFF KENNETH PETERSON: Said, “His detectives worked by the book.”
They absolutely did not work by the book.
2) SHERIFF KENNETH PETERSON: said before the trial, “ He (Steven Avery) will kill again, I think that’s his personality.”
That basically sums up everything. Sheriff Kenneth Peterson was the Judge and Jury that put Steven Avery in prison for eighteen years, and now Sheriff Kenneth Peterson thinks he can be the Judge and Jury once again.
If Sheriff Peterson would have kept his thoughts and actions to himself many innocent people would not have been harmed. There is no chance that Sheriff Kenneth Peterson’s didn't hurt or destroy many others during his corrupt, unethical, despicable career.
3) SHERIFF KENNETH PETERSON: said, “framing Steven Avery would be much too difficult.”
Why is Sheriff Kenneth Peterson telling the public that framing Steven Avery would be too difficult. Is Sheriff Kenneth Peterson entertaining the idea that he thought of the difficulty, even if it was said off the cuff?
If they were my Deputies I wouldn't consider discussing the level of difficulty of framing a human being. The question should have no merit and I would be insulted. Is Sheriff Kenneth Peterson insulted? Quite the opposite, Sheriff Kenneth Peterson wants to say more.
4) SHERIFF KENNETH PETERSON: “If we wanted to eliminate Steve it would've been a whole lot easier to eliminate him. It would be much easier just to kill him.”
Excuse me, this is the answer that Sheriff Kenneth Peterson gives? It is difficult to frame the man, but easy to kill him?
I won't waste two hours explaining how this answer obviously shows Sheriff Kenneth Peterson is not of sound mind.
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson
There is so much involved in this case it would take two weeks to write. I could write a fifty plus page report on former Sheriff Kenneth Peterson alone. This is way beyond a bungled investigation. Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey should be released from prison immediately, and all involved in their prosecution should be investigated properly.
Since I’m not going to spend two weeks right now let me direct this section towards former Sheriff Kenneth Peterson, and part of his involvement in this sad depressing example of our legal system.
The Manitowoc County Sheriff’s department took eighteen years of Steven Avery’s life. The fact that the Manitowic Sheriff’s Department was responsible for this is not disputed by anyone including Manitowoc County and the Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department.
Two years after Steven Avery is released from prison after wasting eighteen years of his life, he is suspected and then later charged with a horrific murder.
If you were the Sheriff in Manitowoc County and you suspected Steven Avery of committing this crime, what you do? Well I know for fact what I would do. I would gather every employee that worked for my department including the cleaning service and tell them this: "We made an awful mistake that sent Steven Avery away for eighteen years. I don't want anyone within a mile of their property, nor do I want you to say one word to Mr. Avery or his friends and family. If I find out you did you will be let go immediately, do you understand?"
Not only did this not happen, the Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department was very involved in the investigation even though they said they would step aside. Can anyone who hasn't seen the Making of a Murderer ten-part series even guess who the Sheriff of Manitowoc County was when this happened?
The Sheriff was Kenneth Peterson. Sheriff Kenneth Peterson was once a Deputy for the Manitowoc Sheriff’s Department, and he was the Deputy that arrested Steven Avery in 1985 with absolutely no evidence. Then Deputy Peterson’s false arrest resulted in the loss of eighteen precious years of Mr. Avery’s life. Now Deputy Kenneth Peterson is Sheriff Kenneth Peterson. Any reasonable Sheriff or public official would want to be as far away from the scene as possible correct?
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson thought it was imperative to be very involved in the Steven Avery investigation.
Why on earth would Sheriff Kenneth Peterson have his hands in every part of the investigation?
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson not only had his hands in every part of the investigation, he had his departments hands all over the investigation.
So much so it was Lieutenant James Lenk and Sergeant Andrew L. Colburn who were in the house days and months after the initial search, and it was Lieutenant Lenk and Sergeant Andrew Colburn who just happened to “find” a lot of evidence.
One of the pieces of evidence that wasn't found by anyone else during the very thorough search was the key to Teresa’s Toyota Rav 4. This key that was found by Lieutenant James Lenk of the Manitowic Sheriff’s Department and Sergeant Andrew L. Colburn of the Manitowic County Sheriff’s Department FOUR days after Mr. Avery’s house was searched.
When the key was analyzed it only had Mr. Avery’s DNA. It didn't have the victims, her roommates or any other person, just Mr. Avery’s.
Lieutenant Lenk and Sergeant Colburn then miraculously found a bullet and eleven shell casings in Steven Avery’s garage four months after his garage had been thoroughly searched over and over again.
It was Sheriff Kenneth Peterson who had one of his Sergeants, Jason Orth, guarding Teresa’s car. It was Manitowic Lieutenant James Lenk, who, under the direction of Manitowic Sheriff Kenneth Peterson, found it necessary to investigate Teresa’s Rav 4 at his leisure and under the watch of Manitowoc County Sergeant Jason Orth.
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson had and has disdain and hatred towards Steven Avery and the Avery family.
Steven Avery was sent to prison for eighteen years by then Deputy Kenneth Peterson.
Steven Avery was suing Manitowic County and the Department, which included Sheriff Kenneth Peterson, Lieutenant James Lenk and Sergeant Andrew Colburn.
Sergeant Andrew Colburn, Lieutenant Lenk, Sheriff Kenneth Peterson and others gave depositions three weeks before Steven Avery once again became a suspect in another horrific crime.
Sheriff Kenneth Peterson and his Department were very involved in this case, and this is very wrong and unjust. This alone taints the investigation and hurts Mr. Avery’s chance at a fair trial.
This on top of mountains of other evidence is not coincidence. The answers are right in front of everyone. The people I listed have to clear their mind, look at what is right in front of them and do the right thing. You can't turn to a higher power, the higher power is turning to you to do the right thing.
Prosecutorial Misconduct Is Rarely Punished, Says New Study | National Law Journal @lifeafterten @48hours @ABC2020 https://t.co/V1gMyUsPXv— Kathleen Zellner (@ZellnerLaw) December 20, 2015
"The things a man has to have are hope and confidence in himself against odds, and sometimes he needs somebody, his pal or his mother or his wife or God, to give him that confidence. He's got to have some inner standards worth fighting for or there won't be any way to bring him into conflict. And he must be ready to choose death before dishonor without making too much song and dance about it. That's all there is to it." - Clark GableLast year, the value of civil asset forfeitures by police exceeded the value of all burglaries in the U.S. https://t.co/AmGW1SE6BN— Radley Balko (@radleybalko) November 18, 2015
[–]Spitriol 18 points 4 months ago
ReplyDeleteWithout MaM it wouldn't have mattered in LE was falsifying and planting evidence. LE take it as a given that the public (rightly or wrongly) trust them to be on the side of the angels. It is human nature to, at least eventually, take advantage of that. That's why they did such a poor job of it. They never dreamed that their actions would be put under such a bright spotlight.
[–]sandman54862 6 points 4 months ago
They are trained in strategic deception so they only know how to lie. Truth never helps anyone in their system. No Humility
[–]Minerva8918 35 points 4 months ago*
"Items on property to conduct searches they provided equipment, and that’s their role and their only role in this investigation."
When I saw the interview, I swear that there was a slight pause before he said "items." I yelled at the tv, "you know damn well you were about to say evidence you motherfucker!"
Anyway, yeah. I just don't understand how the MCSD could justify their being all up in the investigation when they were explicitly told to stay out of it.
[–]singlebeatloaf 8 points 4 months ago
The only reason to make a statement such as this is to intentionally deceive the public. It is the most suspicious thing in the 10 eps of MaM.
[–]Minerva8918 2 points 4 months ago
It's in the second episode, "Turning the Tables"
The press conference in question starts at about 47:05. The part with the quote we're talking about starts at about 48:04.
You'll see him pause, then his lip curls...it's very strange to me!
[–]JonnyDeth 13 points 4 months ago
Made a great excuse to keep the MC Coroner from the scene as well. Then they call in the arson investigator the day AFTER they dig up the fire pit and give the forensic anthropologist a box of bones! And they wonder why people are calling bullshit on their "investigation"?
[–]govt_policy 3 points 4 months ago
You know what concerns me? They say they found DNA on the hood latch, but who's to say they found anything at all? They can literally make up whatever they want because they are the state, and don't allow the defense to test the same objects. They made very sure that various items were never tested by Buting and Strang and that they couldn't point to other potential suspects. And the useless judge just went with it.
[–]monstertrucky 8 points 4 months ago
When you're questioned by law enforcement, if they catch you lying about even the most insignificant little thing, your credibility is gone and you can't get it back. Because why would you lie unless you have something to hide? Why would an innocent person be hiding something from the police? They know you're willing to lie to them, so potentially everything you say is a lie.
This has to go both ways. Once the police are caught lying and we start to suspect that they planted evidence, all of the evidence becomes tainted. We can argue about DNA and EDTA tests and blood vials and bones all we want, but none of that matters if we don't trust every single one of the people who collected, labelled, transported and tested that evidence.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/45pavh/thats_their_role_and_their_only_role_in_this/
[–]K-Nection 5 points 4 months ago
ReplyDeleteI think Calumet's role in this thing is to give the apperance of a non biased investigation. (Warning Speculation) I would bet the conversation happened between the Sherrifs.....
Pagel: Hey you know this is your baby? We are here to make this thing look legit. Your boys Coulbourn, Wiegert and Lenk are doing the actual dirty work.
Petterson: I know nobody is going to suspect you guys of anything. We need to nail this bastard or lots of "decent" cops will lose their jobs....
Pagel: Men who would do things like this make me sick. We will help with the deception...just say we are taking over the investigation. If "anything" is found by your boys just have them hand over to one of us so we can take credit.
Peterson: This Steven Avery prick thinks he can get away with this he has got another thing coming....
[–]skatoulaki 3 points 4 months ago
Pagel stated publicly (see OP) that MCSD was ONLY involved to the extent that they provided equipment. That is obviously not true. A lie is a lie. To later find out that not only were they involved in more than just "providing equipment" but actually were the ones who found key evidence (pun intended) after several prior searches didn't is what makes the entire investigation seem shady. Not to mention, it makes the CASO look like a bunch of shitty investigators...
[–]trakappdotcom 1 point 4 months ago
Its unbelievable that people will still bow to authority because they carry a stamped piece of metal around that says bow to me.
[–]TakesOne2KnowOne 1 point 4 months ago
I'm unsure whether or not they were "ordered" to stay out, but they knew it would be a conflict of interest with the civil suit Avery had against the county (and individual officers that were not covered by insurance and would have had to pay out of pocket via their property, etc.). One thing that is confusing to me is that Ken Kratz was the DA for Calumet County yet it was the Manitowoc County Circuit Court Judge Patrick Willis that presided over the case. I feel that the entire trial should have been outsourced to another county (prosecutor, judge, jurors, etc.).
[–]scotton_wood 3 points 4 months ago
I believe that the defense had a choice to outsource the jurors, but chose to use people from Manitowoc County.
The theory behind that decision was that Kratz's sweaty press conference poisoned the jury pool state wide, so everywhere in the state, the potential jurors thought he was guilty. But the previous wrongful conviction and exoneration wasn't as well known outside Manitowoc County.
If they knew the jurors statewide were predisposed to thinking he was guilty, they felt their best shot was jurors who were predisposed to thinking he was guilty with the background knowledge of his wrongful conviction.
[–]Shaunizzle42 1 point 4 months ago
To me, it doesn't even matter that Calumet was doing the investigating, corrupt cops are corrupt cops, counties, depts, doesn't matter, they all back each other up. It's like a secret society. It's like DOJ Fassbender & Calumet Detective Weigert, they all get each other's backs, right down to the FBI LeBeau. Nothing but scum.
[–]scotton_wood[🍰] 4 points 4 months ago
When I read "equivalent to 5 full-time employees working every hour on the case" I assume that the workers aren't working 24 hour shifts, seven days a week.
5 full time employees working 40 hour weeks = 200 hours.
200 hours for four weeks = 800 hours.
Not quite 744, but close enough.
It's not really 5 full time employees, but more like 4.6 full time employees. I can see why they rounded up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/45pavh/thats_their_role_and_their_only_role_in_this/
Probe into girl's murder became 'unguided missile'
ReplyDeleteReport details how Will County police botched investigation
Chicago Tribune
January 24, 2011
A scathing report released Monday called the botched Riley Fox murder investigation an "unguided missile," detailing major mistakes and recommending sweeping changes in the Will County Sheriff's Office.
Meetings among investigators were "scattershot, disorganized and unproductive," according to the 45-page report by Andrews International, a national security firm hired in July by Will County sheriff's police to scrutinize how detectives wrongly pinned Riley's murder on her father, Kevin Fox.
Management of the investigation was almost nonexistent, portions of the crime scene were never processed or were overlooked, and police missed opportunities from the beginning that could have led to the killer, the report said, including finding the killer's last name written inside sneakers found in a creek where the body of 3-year-old Riley was discovered.
"It is a tragedy that this simple narrative of the crime and the evidence to support it was lost in the 'noise' of the case," the report said. "Investigators were too quick to dismiss the idea that the Riley Fox murder may have been a stranger crime and they were too focused on Kevin Fox to correct their error."
A spokesman for the sheriff's police did not return calls for comment. In June, Sheriff Paul Kaupas said his department made mistakes in the case that he never wanted to happen again. The next month, he ordered the independent review.
The report called Kevin Fox's videotaped confession "highly questionable evidence," with a detective leading him and providing details of the crime. After the confession, Fox was charged with his daughter's murder and jailed for eight months before DNA evidence freed him.
The theory that Kevin Fox accidentally killed his daughter then covered it up "was farfetched in the extreme," the report said. The investigation also found no indication that sheriff's police made mistakes intentionally.
Scott Wayne Eby, 39, was charged in May with snatching Riley from her family's Wilmington home. Eby sexually assaulted Riley, bound her with duct tape and drowned her in a nearby creek on June 6, 2004.
He pleaded guilty in November and was sentenced to life in prison without parole.
Riley's parents, Kevin and Melissa Fox, eventually won $8 million in a lawsuit against the sheriff's office.
The report also criticized Jeff Tomczak, the Will County state's attorney when Kevin Fox was charged. Tomczak appeared to exploit the case, announcing that he was seeking the death penalty during his bid for re-election, which he lost, the report said.
CONTINUED...
Tomczak called the report "Monday-morning quarterbacking." He said the election had no part in his decision to quickly seek the death penalty.
ReplyDelete"Based on what happened to that baby … I was resolved to seek the death penalty since the beginning," Tomczak said.
Kathleen Zellner, an attorney who represents the Foxes, called the report thorough and credited the sheriff's office for following through with it. But she disagreed with some findings and said she believes some investigators framed Kevin Fox.
"I think (the report) described a pattern of such gross negligence," Zellner said. "I think it's an excellent thing to have done, not to just let this incident pass without any changes in their internal procedures."
The report, which was dated Dec. 16 and cost about $100,000, was released Monday after the Tribune filed a Freedom of Information Act request.
The report called for more DNA evidence expertise among detectives and training on how to identify false confessions. Acting on recommendations, Kaupas has expanded detective training and assigned a new commanding officer with investigative experience, the report said.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2011-01-24/news/ct-met-riley-fox-report-20110124_1_scott-wayne-eby-riley-fox-murder-report-details
My top cause for reasonable doubt: liars be lying.... (self.TickTockManitowoc)
ReplyDeletesubmitted by MnAtty
I no longer have any doubts as to whether SA and BD are guilty, because they’re not. And if I can’t make this call, after my years of involvement in the field of criminal law—well, I’m just a gutless wonder.
Steven Avery does not read like a liar, and he was never a habitual criminal. The few things he ever did were blown all out of proportion.
With Brendan Dassey, the research has been laid out—false confessions should be well understood by those reading about this case now. Still, there are people trying to reintroduce doubt, talking about all the things Brendan did say. Basically, you just have to walk away. This argument will never be over. Bottom line is, false confessions are real, and this case illustrates to all those willing to learn, what produces them and how they can be recognized.
So for me, it’s become more about the accusers—I find guilters less credible every day. You can talk all day with these people, and they’ll just talk in circles. And the actual case is going the same way. It’s like they’re rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. I guess they’re going to go down with the ship.
You might think that if you were closer to direct participants, you’d know more about the true story. What would actually happen, though, would be that people would continue to lie to you. You’d find yourself chasing the same ghosts—just from a different perspective.
I’ve been distancing myself from guilters and their constant pitching. It’s like being at a convention for used car salesmen. I don’t know why I didn’t see it before—“ABC”—“Always Be Closing.” "No, I don’t want to buy land in Florida—still no—still no....” Good lord—what will it take?
I guess we've all had to evolve in our understanding of the case. Everything was so shocking at first, that this young woman’s life was snuffed out. It violated every kind of taboo, to feel any empathy for a stone-cold killer, caught dead to rights.
Except none of it is true. You know how they like to say “how could all these things coincide?” or “how could all these people conspire?” Well, you can play that game with any set of facts. We should have a main opinion announcing a contest, to come up with the most ridiculous exaggerations of everyday things. “What are the odds—snow AND ice AND slush?"
We all saw that parade of government employees squirming under questioning. If you’re not familiar with what someone telling lies looks like—that is what it looks like.
One of the reasons for depositions, is to lock a witness in, to a particular statement of the facts. If they decide tomorrow to change their story, they can’t, because their original story is now part of the official record.
Then, in the unusual event that a witness gives perjured testimony, the deposition serves to show this. It’s like a paper trail for statements. “Yesterday you said this, but today you say that.” Most liars slip up, and evidence of their mistakes can be found by reviewing their testimony at different times.
So these are the basic concepts. Now here’s what happened in MaM—what I saw. During the depositions, the witnesses perjured themselves, one right after another. In fact, if anyone finds a way to let me see the full video of these depositions, I’ll give a play-by-play. (Seriously, I know we are spectators, not participants—but it gets frustrating.)
CONTINUED...
Judy Dvorak may be the best example. You remember when her statement from the Attorney General investigation was read back to her, and she refused to acknowledge it? That’s utterly ridiculous.
ReplyDeleteShe did not—absolutely did NOT—want to tell the truth. The problem was, she had already told at least some of the truth to the Attorney General’s Office.
One point made in the MaM documentary, was that when the witnesses spoke to the Attorney General, they thought they were talking to their own people. Because they believed they were discussing events with insiders who were part of the coverup, they told some of the truth, which was then transcribed and made part of the record. This was the first step in the paper trail of lies.
Now, here’s what a liar does. First, a statement is made in which the truth slips out or gets out, somehow. Then, in the witness’s mind, this event disappears from view—the testimony shrinks down to a few typed-up pages, that are tucked away in a file.
In the eyes of the deceptive witness, the original testimony has all but disappeared, being buried in that file. Now, when the witness is called on to give further testimony, it is a different day, a different setting, and a new audience. The incompetent liar does not grasp the concept of the deposition process entirely. This witness thinks it’s more important to maximize concealment from a new audience, than to worry about what’s in that file. This witness will think—incredibly—that this new testimony is a completely fresh start.
Now you’ve got prior statements and a present statement—and they don’t match: you’ve flushed out your liar.
This is what Judy did. When they read back her prior statements to the Attorney General, she denied making those statements. If you’re not familiar with depositions, or if you’re not familiar with lying, her lie was in saying that she wouldn’t “use that language.”
Was she just being fussy? No—she was flat-out lying. Blaming the wording was just a pretext. There’s even a name for this: dissembling. “Dissembling" very specifically describes the manner in which she was lying.
This was more than just a lie—it was an elaborate, calculated lie, used to evade a legal mandate to give truthful testimony. Normally this would be bad, but for Judy, and for other law enforcement or expert witnesses, this is extremely bad, because they are all “officers of the court.” Their duty to the Court comes before any departmental loyalties. There is no excuse—none—ever—to withhold or alter the truth.
CONTINUED...
If anyone remembers way back in January, I came charging out of the blocks, with deep frustration over this very point, and perhaps now, you can see why. I knew everyone was lying, but I wasn’t certain how to explain it to those who didn’t have legal training or litigation experience. I think there was smoke coming out of my ears.
ReplyDeleteThe lying wasn’t even a close call. There was no way to justify or excuse it. When an officer of the court denies their own documented prior testimony, it's a very blatant case of perjury.
There was little or no reaction to this perjury, in the depositions or in the trial scenes we watched. Personally, I find it very improper, that the illegality of it was overlooked. But, this is how these situations are sometimes dealt with. There’s a “wink and a nod” treatment, that I think diminishes and undermines the functioning of the court system.
By the way, the best argument for banning guilters from TTM, may be that we need a place where we can hear ourselves think, to think things through, like I’ve just done, regarding perjured testimony. It took a while to see it. I might have never seen it, if I’d been fending off trolls 24-7.
I tire of guilters’ constant arm-twisting, and I wonder why they’re doing it. The Manitowoc Sheriff’s Department acknowledges monitoring MaM boards. Are some of them going further than just monitoring? SAIG includes members who are clearly law enforcement, so it’s a valid question—but no one can get a straight answer. I don’t like dealing with people who have hidden agendas.
In conclusion, why do I think Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey are innocent? Because the people accusing them are dishonest and not credible. That’s enough for me. Put away all your charts and graphs—we’re done.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/5942g4/my_top_cause_for_reasonable_doubt_liars_be_lying/
[–]JacksnakeJames 5 points 19 hours ago
ReplyDeleteI think they should start at $100 million+, separate from the Avery and Dassey cases, but I also believe Avery and Dassey should each be paid roughly this amount, given the circumstances that led to their imprisonment. I also think, all parties involved in doing this, should be personally held accountable for their part in it. That's how it works for everyone else. Equality under the law is one of the major thing written into our laws. Without it, there can be no justice. It's simply not ok to allow people to get away with injustice, especially to this degree!
Do we have a good estimate of how much money Steven could realistically sue for at this point should he be exonerated?
ReplyDelete[–]JacksnakeJames 6 points 18 hours ago
I was thinking he MIGHT have received $ 1-6 million from his suit for the $36 million. I think a lot of it would depend on the assets of the accused ( which they could have transferred, but then, they would also be guilty a separate federal crime of hiding their assets to prevent as much liability as they could) since a few people were being personal sued. $1-6 million isn't really that much for that many years in prison for something you didn't do, but it would likely bankrupt the people responsible. My guess, is that he would have been awarded roughly $5 million, but about half of that, at least IMO, would have to come from the guilty parties accounts, and NOT FROM THE STATE! They likely didn't have this kind of money sitting around (waiting for the day when SHTF for them) in bank accounts, and they almost certainly were not going to be forced to give it to someone they might have believed to be guilty in the PB case, but was released anyway.The authorities already regarded him as guilty in the PB case, even after the evidence showed that he had not done it! That's very telling on it's own!
[–]MsMinxster[S] 3 points 12 hours ago
I think Jodi had to have been an informant for them at this point.
Agreed. Her arrest records are a mess with charges being dropped then refiled, offense #1 becoming offense #5 (or some such nonsense), etc... I'm beginning to wonder if it was less another instance of messy record keeping but LE dropping charges when she plays ball and maybe refiling when doesn't come through.
now that I see the report saying SA was actually driving takes the cake.
SMH. What about how this disorderly conduct complaint was also somehow attributed to SA? This complaint often gets added to the laundry list of the state's examples of how SA had constant brushes with LE since his exoneration.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/5lw0mv/in_sep_04_mtso_requested_backup_at_avery_rd_for_a/
Chain of custody reports and Receipt of the physical evidence from the Madison crime lab submitted by JH?!!!!! by [deleted] in TickTockManitowoc
ReplyDelete[–]HuNuWutWen 8 points 3 months ago
Any chance of getting the original C O C documents, photos, signatures ?...what's that ?...there are none ?...so, umm...
...well then surely, before they so rightly recused themselves from the investigation and crime scene(s)...
... MTSO secured, cordoned off the alleged crime scene(s), established a contamination path, a grid for accurate logging of collected materials, made way for the LEGALLY REQUIRED CORONER, as per SOP ?...correct ?...what's that ?...no ?...oh, dear...
...okay, but obviously a few of the 150 trained, accredited investigators on scene at ASY were equipped with the basic tools to at least perform the rudimentary, bare minimum functions of their jobs ?...no ?...no huh...
...you mean to to tell the court that NOT ONE OFFICER out of 150 cops on site had a fucking camera ? ...NOT ONE ?...
...and you ultimately were taking turns in a BOBCAT front-end loader, indiscriminately scooping up Steven's back yard ?...is that it ?...this is the story you guys are going with ?...
...and you got into a game of musical burn-barrels ?...does anyone see a problem here ?...no ?...
...and judge Willis allowed all this bullshit into the record ?...
...in fact, 2 people are doing LIFE because of this inexcusable nonsense, misconduct on a scale NEVER before seen in America...
...somebody should call the cops...oh, wait...
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/6gx83x/chain_of_custody_reports_and_receipt_of_the/
[–]tuckerm33 21 points 1 month ago*
ReplyDeleteIf the prosecution deliberately withholds information it collects during the investigation with the purpose of keeping it from the defense, that is a Brady violation.
As others have said, it is not up to the prosecution to determine whether certain pieces of evidence have any benefit to the defense or not.
This reminds me of the overall tone of Steven's trial when Willis claimed "it will only confuse the jury", when he wanted to assist the prosecution in blocking certain testimony or pieces of evidence.
That is completely absurd and utter garbage. It's up to the jury to determine reasonable doubt of evidence and what Willis kept referring to as "confusion" for the jury, was actually reasonable doubt.
In my opinion, Willis absolutely played just as much of a dis-genuine role in Steven's trial as the prosecution did. You will notice that the few times that Willis over ruled the prosecution's objections to the favor of the defense, the objections were basically of little substance to the overall testimony.
In other words KK would object to something trivial just to give Willis something to over rule to make it look like Willis was playing fair and not favoring the state.
It was all for show of course because what did the defense ever really get out of any of those decisions to their favor that helped their case?
What did the State get? The State was granted every request to block the jury from hearing anything and everything that KK did not want them to hear. If it hurts the States case: Object and Sustain. If it hurts the State's case, Request to have the jury dismissed from the room. If the Defense was on a rule and ready to present some damaging testimony or evidence, KK would ask the judge for a lunch break or recess, ever so mindful of the tired and exhausted jury. Anytime the Defense had any sort of momentum going, KK was right there with friendly reminders to the judge about how to run the court.
The State made a case against Steven Avery based on a false confession from Brendan, spread it all over the news for months, then picked a jury after the contamination and then on opening day of trial, KK's first order of tasks is to ask the judge to forbid the use of Brendan's name in front of the jury and Willis, says sure, that's a great idea, I don't want to confuse the jury on the first day.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/6qouax/do_brady_violations_zellnerstyle_actually_have/
If the press was reading this Reddit by hos_gotta_eat_too in TickTockManitowoc
ReplyDelete[–]tuckerm33 3 points 11 months ago*
Although Judge W. did side with JB and DS on some things, those things were never harmful to KK's case.
Judge W. did however side with KK on many things that seem like they were obviously harmful to the defense and I would ask why? The one in particular I would ask about is this.
Why did Judge W. grant KK's request to change the opening instructions to the jury on day 1 of SA's trial? Judge W. granted KK's request to change the language of liability to state SA and "another", where it originally read SA and "BD".
It's not as if Judge W. thought about it for an hour or so in chambers, dug up some case law and then came to a legislative decision. He listened to KK's request and reasoning, listened to DS's opposition and then made more of what I'd call a coin flip decision based on his own opinion. I believe this was a decision that absolutely impacted the defense tremendously, yet Judge W. treated it as benign formality. Another Judge would have perhaps given it the proper credence. Such case altering decisions should not be luck of the draw, dependent upon which judge is presiding over the case. A judge's personal opinion is not judicial.
DS made a great argument about why it should not be changed to "another". KK had tied BD as the co conspirator for 11 months, built his case around it and then suddenly wanted to change it to "another", there by removing himself from the burden of proving BD may have been the co conspirator.
It looks like nothing more than a dirty trick and instead of calling KK out on it, Judge W. grants KK's request.
KK's reason for wanting this was simple. He knew BD's story was bs. In KK's own words. trial transcript day one page 10
" removing the words BD and inserting the words another", "removes the suggestion that the State in some way has a burden, or obligation, or even practically speaking should call Mr. D or insert Mr. D into this case."
I changed the names to initials, but otherwise a direct quote from the transcript.
DS argues this is unfair. He notes first that a previous motion already had forbidden the defense from suggesting a third party liability, (someone other than SA had the ability to commit the crime), and this new request would further hog tie his ability to fairly defend his client
Trial transcript day 1 page 13 "It's not consistent with the positions the State has taken to date and it leaves Mr. A. on the one hand, unable to suggest directly the liability of a third person; and yet, on the other hand, defending a potentially shifting or unstated theory on who his accomplice or accessory may have been."
Judge W agrees with KK and only sort of acknowledges DS's concern, ultimately he sides with KK anyway.
CONTINUED...
Trial transcript day 1 page 16 "I agree that it's not a good idea at the start of the trial to focus attention on Mr. Dassey; although, I understand that's the basis of the State's party to the crime theory."
ReplyDeleteJudge W. knows it's a big deal in KK's case, but conveniently and falsely downplays the significance and impact that changing the wording will have on the jury. He insists it's not a big deal and that he can just add BD's name in the closing instructions at the end of the trial if need be. His claim is that it will have no impact on SA's case, but it's just a blatant inaccuracy that should not have been allowed.
Of course it will have an impact on the jury. They will have already formed their opinion by time the closing arguments come around and you just know that without needing to show who the "another" was, all the jury will care about is deciding if it seemed possible that SA could have killed her with someone's help. Who helped him? It doesn't matter, don't worry about that part. At least that is the message the jury took away from the revised language.
It wouldn't matter who's name you put in place of "another" after the fact. That's just a face for the jury by time the closing arguments come around. They have already formed their opinions. You can add in the name BD at the end and the jurors will just think, "Oh so that's who it was". It's not in their permissible duties to question it at that point.
Judge W decision on changing the opening language Trial transcript day 1 page 16 "..opening instructions, the purpose of which is simply to make it easier for the jurors to follow the evidence and understand what it is the State has to prove in order to justify a guilty verdict."
Umm, yeah, exactly the point DS was trying to make to Judge W. KK is sitting there about to demonstrate why he believes SA is guilty of murder. He's made up a story entirely based on conjecture, pieced together and fabricated completely based on a "confession" from BD, but yet wants to remove BD's name from the story so he doesn't have to be held accountable for the confession. That is absolutely not fair and should not have been allowed.
CONTINUED...
KK knew if he kept BD's name in there, then he would have to prove not only that SA murdered TH, but he would also have to prove that BD was the helper. If he can't prove both points, then there is no conviction. KK's story of SA as the killer with someone's help, obviously believable to the jury and SA gets convicted. If KK presented a story with SA and BD both as the killers, BD breaks down that story and then neither are convicted of the murder. KK never intended to put BD up on the stand. He knew the jury would realize pretty quickly that BD's story was not consistent with KK's fabrication even if he could get BD to still somehow admit involvement which by this point, BD had no intentions of doing because he had already made it known that his confession was false. KK made the decision that he'd wait to even put BD on a stand when he tried him separately. Break the story into two parts and get two convictions. Use both cases against one another to prosecute each case.
ReplyDeleteKK built his case around BD's "confession". KK was prosecuting SA based on BD's "confession". KK would have had nothing but a very circumstantial case against SA if not for BD's "confession". So, yeah, damn straight KK should have been held accountable and forced to prove both SA and BD were TH's killers and committed the crime together. If that's your theory and you built a case around it, then that's the way you should have to present it. If Judge W. had ruled on that the way he should have, chances are neither of these two would have been convicted, a possibility that I'm sure was not lost on his honor.
Link to Trial Transcript. http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Jury-Trial-Transcript-Day-1-2007Feb12.pdf#11
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/586vp8/if_the_press_was_reading_this_reddit/
tossers by Debbiecass34 in TickTockManitowoc
ReplyDelete[–]tuckerm33 3 points 11 months ago*
Just an opinion comment from me. I may be wrong, just my thoughts though...
In my opinion, most of the trolls that post on MaM, or SAIG, or even try to post nasty things on TTM are really just people working for/hired by people on the other side of the case, in others words, the prosecution/LE/State etc..
It is very reasonable to think this could be the possibility. Those same individuals will likely be the one's to disagree with me that it happens, but those are the same individuals that love to throw the ol' "tin foil hats" term on anyone with a theory. It's a term used to make someone seem crazy or outlandish.
I understand their tactic. It's an evil necessity for those on the other side because they need to mitigate the amount of people that are exposed to the truth of the frame job uncovered by MaM.
After MaM came out, we all know what happened and so that whole gang of corrupt individuals from the prosecution side basically took on the task to destroy the MaM sub to basically shut us up and minimize the amount of backlash they were receiving. When that worked, Hos then went and created TTM for us, and now the trolls try to come here.
Did anyone see Adam Sandler's movie Happy Gillmore? If you did, then you know about the heckler that Shooter McGavin hired to mess with Happy while he was golfing, to screw him up and ruin his game because he was winning. He would say "Jack Ass!" just as Happy was ready to tee off.
While that was a movie about a fictional character, it is the same premise of what the corrupt officials have taken to here, about a real person. The voice of the public outcry after watching MaM was far too great for them to leave it be. They knew it was going to be their undoing and so they set out to minimize those of us that would demand change.
I'm certainly not saying that there aren't some individuals out there that truly believe SA is guilty and have no agenda other than to speak their minds, but for the ones that really adhere to those beliefs with such passion and unwillingness to even entertain the idea that the case may have been compromised; that seems delusional to me.
It is at that point where the only explanation for me is that anyone that loathsome, such as the those listed by the OP, but not limited to, must be doing what they do for the reasons i described above.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/568x97/tossers/
[–]tuckerm33 3 points 12 months ago
ReplyDeleteOdd the solo things in that burn pit. One bone that could be identified. One tooth. One rivet. Just enough to be believed. Bare minimum.
Absolutely. KK put so much circumstantial stuff out there for the jury, that at the end of the day, it sort of gives this illusion that there is a $hit tone of evidence, when there isn't. Your post made me think of one important thing too.
As r\SBRH33 pointed out, "in this episode during BoD testimony that Kratz is using the computer generated image of the set up of the Janda/ Avery property."
It just kills me that KK actually hired someone to create those computer genertaed layouts of the property when all they had to do was take some actual damn pictures. That would have been easier.
IMO, the reason he purposely went the computerized route is because he didn't want real/useful pictures of the "crime scene", ie property and burn pit etc..
His reasoning though wasn't because of what real pictures would show, it was what they wouldn't show.
KK wanted to paint an image in the jury's mind that something really horrible happened there that day and he couldn't risk having the jury distracted with real things like no bones in the pit and drawing their own conclusions.
Don't think for yourself, big bad KK is on the job. I'll tell you what to think. Everything he did was carefully orchestrated, yet he suggests that MaM was full of self serving edits. His entire case was one big self-serving edit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/54ziyl/rewatching_the_documentary_episode_5/
[–]tuckerm33
ReplyDeleteKratz controlled everything in the timing. He rambles on and on and on whenever he wanted to run the jury to lunch, leave them to think about his points while they ate, gave them time to form opinions in there minds. Legally they are not supposed to, but human nature is what it is and you can't keep your mind from wondering even if you keep you thoughts to yourself. When that wasn't a deploy able option for Kratz, he would ask for sidebars or ask to have the jururs excused. In the instance with Zipperer, Kratz new he would lose his ass if he put Mr. Zipperer up there on the stand. The only reason Strang didn't push the issue, as you see in the trial transcript, is because Kratz said Strang could confirm his questions with Derdering, which Kratz lied to the judge and said he was going to put him up next and never did. Kratz kills more time and then instead calls Ryan Hillegas up next, wasting more time and making it impossible for Derdering to be put up on the stand. Kratz however being the prosecutor had some candy ass privileges and immunity against misconduct. In the end, I bet if Strang forced the issue with Derdering, Kratz would have said something to the judge again, objected, asked for a sidebar, asked for the jury to be dismissed...repeat. repeat. repeat.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/4cqse1/zipperer/
Some people say it is bunk, but.... (self.TickTockManitowoc)
ReplyDeleteby headstilldown
When something like KZ's recent affidavit claims come out, it seems a majority will immediately call it bunk. Not that they know anything... just that they are rigid in their opinions. Things like: "why are they first saying it now ?", "why did they not tell police then?", "why is it the first anyone is hearing this?", etc.
Those comments are immediate indicators that they have never once been close enough to a bad scenario like this ever. The fact of the matter is, people CAN be telling LE, Judges and Prosecutors all sorts of things. They can be screaming... but no one hears them. Investigators and DA's will quickly pick and choose what THEY want to use, believe, or allow the population to believe. They will control media to manage their goals.
If someone real close to a bad circumstance goes to small town media in attempt to expose something they know to be 100% true, trust me when I say that, that very same media will NEVER attempt to make any waves with their long time community legal "friends", and will much rather put you on a blacklist of sorts as a nutjob (and even after you have been vindicated 100%, your still labeled a nutjob). Family members are specifically shut down as those rigid in opinions are quick to claim " they are just saying that to protect the criminal" (which may or may not be true).
In Manitowoc's first murder exoneration (Terens), the arresting officers, the interrogators, the Sheriff (TKocourek himself), the DA (EJFitzgerald himself), the Judge (FHazelwood himself), the local media, AND the big guy right there in the Wisconsin Attorney Generals Office were all made VERY AWARE of exactly how and why they got a jury to render a conclusion on a completely false, unreliable, un-factual, impossible "Confession"...... and this was long BEFORE SENTENCING. NONE of them cared the least. It took 3 full years, tons of legal wrangling, and one single brave attorney who stood up to this cowardice if not criminal in itself act before a second trial was granted, which subsequently exposed the complete circus of fools Manitowoc had there (not that any of them were held accountable in any way).
Examples can be seen all over the Avery case as well....., where a woman attempts to forward some potential evidence in the form of ladies underwear, and a lengthy story of strangeness from an obviously strange guy. What did LE do with this information ? Told her they did not need it... they had it all figured out. Point being, even ten years later, for all anyone knows she very well could have been screaming truth from the rooftops... and few would care.
Another is an older man who says he saw a similar vehicle to TH's drive into the pit, tailed by another car. Someone decided for the jury whether this mattered or not, long before the case was heard by them. If this really was truth, rest assured, people will belittle it as nothing, regardless of the man's integrity.
CONTINUED...
I'm not saying the individuals above "evidence" was or was not anything... I'm not saying I think the "A" boys are innocent or guilty (Manty themselves screwed this up so bad by their actions, there may be no way of ever knowing). All I am saying is that PLENTY of good honest people are NOT heard, listened to or believed in most if not all of these legal nightmares.
ReplyDeleteA hard to deny fact is that in practically EVERY exoneration that has taken place, there are specific things that were indeed SAID, but ignored, hushed down, not presented..... In Manitowoc's earlier exoneration, people WERE belittled, intimidated and somewhat threatened by government officials for even speaking out. No surprise to me people would refrain from speaking out at all.
Pray you or your family never get anywhere near a serious legal case. Seems everyone loses something. If you get caught in one, it changes your life forever. You quickly learn that the necessary evil in the middle of it (the justice system and media friends) all turn out to simply be kind faces with smiles........ that you can never really trust.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/74nzmq/some_people_say_it_is_bunk_but/
Screw what courts and legal analysts have to say, I choose to believe Zellner no matter what(r/MakingaMurderer)
ReplyDeletesubmitted 2 months ago by NewYorkJohn to r/MakingaMurderer
iDLe76 • 1 point • submitted 2 months ago
Screw fake internet lawyers and legal analysts!
You lot employ the same tactics as the 'investigators' in this case.
It'd be the same if we could teleport back and discuss the 85 case. GAF GAF GAF GAF GAF GAF GAF GAF GAF... until he's proven innocent and the whole charade falls apart.
I'm still disgusted by the lack of punishment for those fools involved back then. Seeing them being deposed was the only payback but they deserved so much more but conveniently avoided it.
It's not easy fighting this kind of corruption but the cuts are stacking up and sooner or later the truth will flood out.
NewYorkJohn • 6 points • submitted 2 months ago
He was convicted in 1985 because of the victim made a mistake. That is why the DOJ cleared the police and DA of wrongdoing.
He was convicted in 2005 because a mountain of evidence that proved his guilt.
There is no corruption except in your imagination you are tilting at windmills.
iDLe76 • 3 points • submitted 2 months ago
BS
He was convicted in 85 due to LE bias and corruption. What kind of investigation goes like this...
Do we have a suspect?
Yeah sounds like SA.
OK den.
What about Mr Rapey McStalker who we have tons of shit on? You know the nasty fucker who lunged at someone on this very beach? The horrible fella the PD have been watching for months, I mean it's totally his MO. Should we at least exclude him by means of DNA testing?
Nah what the fuck you on about it's clearly SA.
He has 16 witnesses.
It's SA.
He has proof he was miles away.
It's SA.
Get him in prison now.
Victim gets harassing calls after SA is locked up.
It must be SA from jail. Stop his phone privileges for a while!
On appeal he proved it's not his DNA on those nail scrapings so they surely must let him go now?
No chance. It's SA!
They finally find clear DNA evidence that points directly to the real perp who should have been suspect No1 right from the start and he's finally free.
Now that's some mistake.
05.Bias and corruption. None of the evidence is worth anything once you understand who and how it was obtained
https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/7bww2r/screw_what_courts_and_legal_analysts_have_to_say/
Breaking the Conspiracy of Silence (self.TickTockManitowoc)
ReplyDeletesubmitted 1 day ago * by magilla39
Physical Evidence was Planted
Zellner's investigation has made one thing perfectly clear. Most, if not all, of the physical evidence found on the Avery property was planted. The magic key and the magic bullet were planted beyond reasonable doubt, and Zellner's experts make it quite clear that the blood in the RAV4, the DNA on the hood latch swab and the bones in the burn pit were planted to a reasonable degree of scientific certainty.
Footnote eight (8) on page 76 of the Motion for Post Conviction Relief suggests that the bones found in Janda Burn Barrel #2 were only found after fully processing its contents once and not finding them, and given Zellner's arguments and facts showing that the other evidence was planted, it seems likely that the burnt electronics in Steven's burn barrel were planted too.
Known Co-conspirators
Colburn and Lenk are clearly implicated in the planting of the magic key. In addition, the magic bullet was either planted by law enforcement personnel during the two day March 2006 search of Steven Avery's garage, or Sherry Culhane planted Teresa's DNA using samples she had in her custody at the Wisconsin State Crime Lab.
There is more than probable cause to open an investigation into the planting of evidence by these individuals.
Breaking the Conspiracy of Silence
What's most needed is a witness from within the law enforcement circle to break their conspiracy of silence. The actual perpetrators have too much to lose to risk talking, but there must be someone in the know, who is only tangentially in contact with the Manitowoc cadre, that can point this investigation toward the truth, and can expose the conspiracy to its light!
Don't let their crimes be ignored and swept under the rug! We must find someone to break the conspiracy of silence!
ETA: Challenge
I challenge anyone to present reasonable arguments demonstrating that the magic key and magic bullet were not planted.
CONTINUED...
[–]madmarkman40 7 points 1 day ago
ReplyDeleteWhat reasonable degree of SCIENTIFIC certainty tells us the blood was planted. I'm sorry I don't see any. I believe it was planted but I really do want to know conclusively that it was. I know of a completely viable way that that blood could have got in those areas, I have first-hand experience of how this could easily happen. I will not fuel the other side by divulging this information
[–]magilla39[S] 4 points 1 day ago
Read the expert affidavit. That is the expert's conclusion.
[–]madmarkman40 5 points 1 day ago
well, we have experts that say the opposite so science at this point is not conclusive on that blood. Like I say, I can and have reproduced all them markings and patterns in one go with one injury; and like I say, I will not divulge this information to feed the other side. You are one of the best posters here. I and other posters completely trust your posts so I'm not trying to pick a fight; just pointing out that KZ expert at the moment with the limited resources (the actual car) is using professional opinion as opposed to actual proof. My thoughts are the swing by the jury was 100% down to the blood in the RAV; everything else, as most everyone can see, is floored
[–]skippymofo 3 points 17 hours ago
We have experts that said the opposite? I hope you do not mean SC. She is not an expert at all.
[–]madmarkman40 1 point 3 hours ago
I'm just saying, one side says one thing is possible and the other says something else. Both are possible but the truth is, until proper analysis of the actual rav4 by 100% credible professionals with the most up to resources, then it’s just he said she said.
[–]magilla39[S] 0 points 1 day ago
The blood pattern analysis expert's affidavit addressed multiple errors made by the expert presented by the prosecution at trial. So it will be very interesting to hear how this shakes out when there is an evidentiary hearing.
Are you claiming to have other experts supporting the state?
[–]madmarkman40 6 points 20 hours ago
No, I'm claiming I could reproduce the blood patterns or give a completely viable way that it happened. Mistakes are mistakes: it doesn't mean a thing. In my head, it was all done with that kit they carry, but that's not evidence or proof. The prosecution is not looking for ways it wasn't steven, and the defence is not looking for ways it was.
[–]magilla39[S] 1 point 10 hours ago
You can cut your finger and while you’re actively bleeding: you can reproduce the locations of the blood, without leaving blood anywhere else?
[–]madmarkman40 1 point 3 hours ago
yes, easy
https://www.reddit.com/r/TickTockManitowoc/comments/7tgg1y/breaking_the_conspiracy_of_silence